There has been lots of debate and discussion about 540 recently – particularly in light of ORRCA Qld’s decision to make it a 16 and under age-based class.
If I was in charge (and no doubt many people would be happy I’m not!), there are three basic things I would do…
1. “Promote” Drivers out of the class: Without question I would be implementing some rules aimed at promoting long-term and successful drivers out of 540. I’d start by saying that if you finish Top 5 at a Queensland Championships in any class, then the following years you would not be elegible for 540. I’d be encouraging the SEQ Clubs to follow a similar standard for the Interclub – top 5 are promoted.
2. Develop a “Banned” List of Chassis: Unfortunately there are ridiculous amounts of money and ridiculous equipment levels in use in 540 racing. At first glance it seems difficult to control but if I were in charge, I would develop a list of chassis that were ineligible (BANNED) for 540 racing. On it would be every current model competition car (Schumacher Mi2-EC, Assoc TC4-FT, Losi JRXS, X-Ray T2-007, HB Cyclone, Top Scythe, Tamiya 415 MSXXABC etc). That leaves the field open to entry level cars (such as RTR-TC4’s and TA05’s) along with the previous generation competition chassis (Losi XXX-S, Schumacher Mi2, Assoc TC3, XRay FK05 etc). This not only prevents people feeling like they must go out and purchase the latest chassis to be competitive, but it also preserves the second hand market. Drivers are racing with either cheaper new cars, or with second hand (last generation) competition chassis. If you wanted to you could do something similar with electronics (eg a “banned” list of Speed Controllers or at least a price cap).
3. Tyres: I’d be setting nominated controlled tyres for 540 at all levels of racing (obviously needs the cooperation of clubs and ORRCA) and I’d ban tyre warmers. Say for example Sorex 36 for race meetings between October and March, and TakeOff 27 for April to September.
The point of course, is to try and (a) preserve 540 for beginners, younger/less experienced drivers and those happy to race on a tight budget in what is clearly a beginners/novice/clubman kind of class; and (b) to make it cheaper and closer racing.
That’s my view…
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14 responses to “If I Were in Charge of 540!”
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Scott,
i agree to a degree,
if u were to say u can use old model chassis that wouldnt be fair as some brands update nearly every 12 months and some dont, so i preffer no double deck carbon fibre yes it rules out ever schumacher car after the mi2 as all are carbon fibre but look at the bigger picture its easier to police and less debateable
policeing electronics is impossible as you cannot put a price cap cause whats $300 here is $150 overseas which price we use?
id like to see no match batterys although cannot be policed it would discourage spending to most.
spec tire for seq great idea dont agree with ur winter choice but ive always ran sorex,
also no high end radio gear (3pk helios r1 m11 atc) all banned.
i think thats about all we can do
an age limit isnt the fairest way but is the easiest to police.
i feel my opinion is valid as im just to old for 540 and have tried stock only to have my a$$ handed to me and want to go back to 540, but ive tried and want to build my skill level while not destroying other peoples cars. thats my excuse.
something has to be done and this 16yr old rule is not the entire answerLikeLike
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Hi Josh, Thanks for the comment.
The reason I think allowing superseded “competition” cars to compete is that the objective here is to make 540 affordable. You can go and buy a second hand competition car (like a Schumacher Mi2 for example) for as cheap as $150. It’s the new $700 car that is the issue I’m suggesting we challenge.
Price caps on electronics are more difficult – but still feasible with a standard (like the Australian importer’s recommended retail price).
I’m not actually suggesting those tyres – just giving an example. But sharing it amoung a couple of different manufacturers isn’t a bad idea (eg Sorex, Take Off).
I agree the age limit isn’t the total answer. We could however recognise the best performing juniors in 540 – a class within a class for example. I know the Qld Titles have a top junior award, but we don’t make a big deal of it. I think we could award 1st, 2nd, 3rd for junior drivers in 540.
Anyway, just thoughts.LikeLike
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Hi Scott,
I think what you have suggested is sound and fair .Things need to be looked at in this way to have a good level playing field for all competitors.Obviously as you say this is an example of a direction to go in and deserves looking at. But i think we need to have a beginner class for everyone though ,there are some late bloomers into our sport and to have them go straight into stock is a scary experience for them .
I guess the age limit is a start but as numbers vary in the age of our newbies it does create its own problems.LikeLike
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The age limit is the best fix for the short term, simply because very few (if any) kids under 16 could afford the sort of equipment you would have banned anyway.
Adults however, regardless of their experience, would have much less trouble in running the latest expensive gear, therefore adding to the current problem.
So it makes sense to have the age limit in place until a more defined set of rules (as suggested by Scott) can be agreed on.LikeLike
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firstly the age rule is not going to work
some one has said that adults can afford the good gear
( well think again because they cant ! )
but can they race ? if not let them race 540
i like the idea of limited gear
i have 3 missions in my shed and i havent raced for well over a year !
from where i stand as an ex driver that dropped out after not being able to afford to compete and also having to say to my then 13 year old son sorry you cant race because i cant buy the gear for you to compete with
540 has to be a budget class not an age class
un matched batteries are to hard to keep tabs on
control tyres are good
control chassis are good
i wish all the luck in the world for guys on commitees and organisations like QRRCA
because from were i stand they have a hard job ahead of themselves to get the numbers back
all the best
richard loweLikeLike
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I can understand why ORRCA has made these “tuff” decisions, and although I support your intentions (Scott), but one of the most difficult and secondary issues that ORRCA needs to deal with is enforcement. The way they’ve gone about the 540 issue should be effective and easy to enforce.
On the surface, your suggestion seems simple to administer, but it opens up the debate of which chassis should be banned;
Which driver should be banned.. (After several years absent from race… ???);
And which tyre to choose and enforcing the ban on tyre warmers……
Some may think I’m over emphasising these points, but I’d like to suggest to them, “nothing is impossible for those that don’t have to do it themselves”
It’s tuff being on ORRCA and try to make the right decisions for the sport because you know you’re not going to please everyone and those that disagree are usually the “Loud” ones…..
Best of luck ORRCA….LikeLike
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This would be all great stuff. I guess you can band the latest technology which would not be hard. A quick walk arround or check-in area when everyone arrives would easily determine what is allowed in the 540 class.
As for age. I think majority don’t like this and that there are a lot of alternatives, as stated – restrict batteries, current models of cars and high end electronics, etc.
We need to promote 540 as a beginner class and well you are not a beginner if you have matched batteries, tyre warmers and the likes. Retricting to maybe second hand gear is a start.
Promoting known drivers and the top 5 finishes that seems fair as don’t we all want to better ourselves. Standing still (staying in the same class) isn’t going to make us better.
But we just need to take things one step at a time.
Scott and David good luck and hope to see things changed as well.
Robert.LikeLike
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I agree Peter that enforcement of rules is an issue. I guess what I would think/hope is that in 540 it should be less of an issue than in other classes. If 540 really is a beginners/novice class rather than a full-on competition class and is promoted and treated as such, then perhaps iron-fist enforcement isn’t needed. Stock and mod, that’s another story!
I certainly don’t envy those on ORRCA Qld for a moment (lots of us have worn those shoes in the past!). They have a tough job to do. My aim here is simply to throw a couple of what I think are constructive ideas into the mix.
I probably have similar thoughts about entry level gas tourer classes – but I won’t go there (for now!).LikeLike
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I race 540 and I want there to be a 540 pro class and a separate 540 junior/beginner with all them rules that you say. As i enjoy 540 even on a competitive level as it is a lot easyer/cheaper on the car (tyres dont wear out as quick/ parts dont break as easy etc…)
they should keep 540 pro for the pro’s!!!!
just my 2 cents!!!LikeLike
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I agree with Paul. I also think they should have two different classes for stock brushed/bruhless. How can we compete with brushless systems? I’m over 16 and I certainly cant afford to compete.
Cheers
AdrianLikeLike
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I’m a bit reluctant to wade into this debate being a bit gun shy after the pasting I took over the Interclub rules – I have given some indication of my thinking in my signature on RC Tech.
I think we need a beginners class into which we can invite and attract beginners irrespective of age – 540 seems to be the most likely class to succeed. I know from Fairfield experience and also from Hobby Station that beginners are afraid of going straight into stock. I also know that the kids have more fun and enjoyment when they are in a class of there own.
At club level it would be good if we had two classes operating – say 540 and 540 pro – my view is the equipment makes no difference. If a person can do the required laps in 540 then he is arbitrarily moved on to 540 Pro. Problem with this suggestion is getting the numbers to make it work, but what comes first – the chicken or the egg.
At Interclub level 540 should be offered but at half points so that the trophy hunters and the clubs that want to stack 540 for a points haul would not be attracted to do that. At State Titles level an under 16 class has some merit in my view.
What clubs should be about is attracting members and giving them enjoyment and a place to experience racing and grow with it if they want. The higher levels of competition are about providing a higher platform for those that want keener competition, at this level beginners have to either step up – and plenty do – or decide to remain at club level, race for fun meets.
If and when I get another mid-week meeting going I will run 2 x 540 classes, Novice and Pro with a compulsory move on mechanism – it’s a fact of life that some people will never reach the trigger point and so be it they can stay in novice if they wish to continue racing for as long as they like. I think we will also have a minimum standard in 540 Pro before a driver will be able to move to Stock as well. There are benchmarks and standards in most sports so why not in ours ?
There you go boys, have a chew on that.
HeavyLikeLike
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Sounds good to me , I like it, I really hope there is/ will be enough numbers as i really want 540 pro to kick off 🙂
LikeLike
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I was thinking of getting back into racing, planning to start off with 540 just to get back into the swing of things…but after seeing what went into prepping 540 motors at the summer cup at logan..i really think something needs to be done…running motor’s in with brasso then dumping it on the ground..not really cool!!!and being told by the person doing the tuning that brushless stock are very unfair against the brushed stock?.
Maybe people that want to race at these types of events need to place their 540 in a box and go (lucky dip) after each heat,that way everyone has a chance of a quick motor in at least one heat.
If you can create 2 classes of 540 (novice=production class),(540 pro=V8’s) then i’ll be there in a flash.
Maybe even put a battery limit on production class..say nothing bigger than 3300.
There you go heavy edit it as you see fit .
This post should take the heat off you.
Terry SidLikeLike
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Guys two classes of 540 would be great.
Limiting chassiss and equipment ect is also good
Although we have four-five cars between myself and my son (gas and eletric) not one is new. All second – third hand all the chargers equilizlers ect are too
We both got new radios this year . my old one KO from the early 80’s packed it in
and the cheap RTR radios suffer than poor reception.
That said limiting battery size will work but once again we have secondhand 3800’s
along with somenow old 4200’s bought for the QLD’s last year (4sets in total for both of us)
Everybody knows that if you brough new there would be 2000- 3000 $ of gear on the bench. (once again two drivers). It is an expensive hobby they all are.
Some drivers do seem to have overkilled it a little. Two – three power supplies four charges two- three discharges ect. but it’s their money if it mades it easier for them to run it must add more time for fun.
Some mod drivers show up with precharged batteries and a Car ready to Race
they don’t wont the hassle of all the gear.
I must say that the level of 540 racing at logan is fairly high at the moment witch makes for good racing. I don’t think i would stay there if i wasnt chasing Sonny Johnny Brad and the others. It’s the close racing at a pace i can handle not the motor size
Yet i have a long way to go if i wanted to be mid field in stock.
Why not start with two classes with in the same heat just add hanicaps
Then you would have an outright winner and a class winner (small yacths race to hobart to you know
My 2centsLikeLike
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